AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

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iJoel
Regular User
Posts: 124
Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 7:25 am

AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by iJoel »

I'm working on re-encoding a lot of my DVDs to include multiple audio tracks (instead of the default AAC+AC3, two tracks) because I'm quite fond of commentary tracks ;P.
But apparently the AppleTV can't seem to sit well with these 3 tracks apparently (Downmixed [AAC], Surround [AC3], and Commentary [AAC], all English).
As no matter what I do, the AppleTV always plays commentary track over the Main Audio on the 2.3 firmware (the 2.2 firmware seemed to ONLY choose the main, and not even let me choose the commentary).

I've encoded it with the GUI, which I later realized was useless because the AppleTV needed "audio names" which the GUI doesn't support.
So I used Muxo to change the audio tracks names, which did in fact change them on the AppleTV but it still defaulted to the Commentary.

I then used the CLI to do a fresh encode of the DVD, while inputting the names of each ("Downmixed", "Surround", and "Commentary" respectively).
This actually made the AppleTV play the main "Downmixed" track on first play, but when I changed the track to Commentary, and then back to "Downmixed"
the AppleTV plays the "Commentary" track as default now, no matter what I do.

And the the encode with the CLI (ctivity log below), the audio options on the AppleTV are:

-English
-English (Downmixed)
-English (Commentary)

Seems out of order to me, but that's probably because I left the "Surround" track's name the default name?
Anybody else have the same problem?
Or will I just have to live without commentary?

Thanks

Log:

Code: Select all


iMac:~ Joel$ /Applications/HandBrakeCLI -i /Users/Joel/Movies/BatchRip/Eternal\ Sunshine -L -o ~/Movies/movie.mp4  -e x264 -q 0.589999973773956 -a 1,1,4 -A "Downmixed","Surround","Commentary" -E faac,ac3,faac -B 160,auto,64 -R 48,Auto,48 -6 dpl2,auto,stereo -D 1.5,1.0,1.25  -f mp4 -X 720 -P -m -x level=30:cabac=0:ref=3:mixed-refs=1:analyse=all:me=umh:no-fast-pskip=1 -v
[15:02:24] hb_init: checking cpu count
[15:02:24] hb_init: starting libhb thread
HandBrake 0.9.3 (2008112300) - http://handbrake.fr/
2 CPUs detected
Opening /Users/Joel/Movies/BatchRip/Eternal Sunshine...
[15:02:24] hb_scan: path=/Users/Joel/Movies/BatchRip/Eternal Sunshine, title_index=0
[15:02:24] scan: trying to open with libdvdread
[15:02:24] scan: DVD has 11 title(s)
[15:02:24] scan: scanning title 1
[15:02:24] scan: opening IFO for VTS 1
[15:02:24] pgc_id: 1, pgn: 1: pgc: 0xf074d0
[15:02:24] scan: vts=1, ttn=1, cells=0->21, blocks=0->3315692, 3315693 blocks
[15:02:24] scan: duration is 01:47:41 (6461166 ms)
[15:02:24] scan: checking audio 1
[15:02:24] scan: id=80bd, lang=English (AC3), 3cc=eng ext=0
[15:02:24] scan: checking audio 2
[15:02:24] scan: id=89bd, lang=English (DTS), 3cc=eng ext=0
[15:02:24] scan: checking audio 3
[15:02:24] scan: id=82bd, lang=Francais (AC3), 3cc=fra ext=0
[15:02:24] scan: checking audio 4
[15:02:24] scan: id=83bd, lang=English (AC3) (Director's Commentary 1), 3cc=eng ext=3
[15:02:24] scan: checking subtitle 1
[15:02:24] scan: id=20bd, lang=English, 3cc=eng
[15:02:24] scan: checking subtitle 2
[15:02:24] scan: id=21bd, lang=Espanol, 3cc=spa
[15:02:24] scan: checking subtitle 3
[15:02:24] scan: id=22bd, lang=Francais, 3cc=fra
[15:02:24] scan: title 1 has 21 chapters
[15:02:24] scan: chap 1 c=0->0, b=0->122469 (122470), 221474 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 2 c=1->1, b=122470->346546 (224077), 407513 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 3 c=2->2, b=346547->439570 (93024), 174314 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 4 c=3->3, b=439571->571678 (132108), 251434 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 5 c=4->4, b=571679->635910 (64232), 117242 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 6 c=5->5, b=635911->810856 (174946), 336462 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 7 c=6->6, b=810857->902015 (91159), 168319 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 8 c=7->7, b=902016->1135148 (233133), 427540 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 9 c=8->8, b=1135149->1383520 (248372), 477582 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 10 c=9->9, b=1383521->1579670 (196150), 382325 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 11 c=10->10, b=1579671->1665565 (85895), 164159 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 12 c=11->11, b=1665566->1893805 (228240), 430442 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 13 c=12->12, b=1893806->2009852 (116047), 208353 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 14 c=13->14, b=2009853->2405277 (395425), 776994 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 15 c=15->15, b=2405278->2572763 (167486), 337307 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 16 c=16->16, b=2572764->2657430 (84667), 174148 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 17 c=17->17, b=2657431->2880436 (223006), 442542 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 18 c=18->18, b=2880437->3004216 (123780), 247210 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 19 c=19->19, b=3004217->3244074 (239858), 493420 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 20 c=20->20, b=3244075->3315687 (71613), 221374 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 21 c=21->21, b=3315688->3315692 (5), 1000 ms
[15:02:24] scan: aspect = 0
[15:02:24] scan: scanning title 2
[15:02:24] scan: opening IFO for VTS 2
[15:02:24] pgc_id: 1, pgn: 1: pgc: 0xf07360
[15:02:24] scan: vts=2, ttn=1, cells=0->1, blocks=0->101913, 101914 blocks
[15:02:24] scan: duration is 00:05:54 (354120 ms)
[15:02:24] scan: checking audio 1
[15:02:24] scan: id=80bd, lang=English (AC3), 3cc=eng ext=0
[15:02:24] scan: title 2 has 2 chapters
[15:02:24] scan: chap 1 c=0->0, b=0->101908 (101909), 353120 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 2 c=1->1, b=101909->101913 (5), 1000 ms
[15:02:24] scan: aspect = 0
[15:02:24] scan: scanning title 3
[15:02:24] scan: opening IFO for VTS 3
[15:02:24] pgc_id: 1, pgn: 1: pgc: 0xf07480
[15:02:24] scan: vts=3, ttn=1, cells=0->1, blocks=0->211395, 211396 blocks
[15:02:24] scan: duration is 00:11:33 (693076 ms)
[15:02:24] scan: checking audio 1
[15:02:24] scan: id=80bd, lang=English (AC3), 3cc=eng ext=0
[15:02:24] scan: title 3 has 2 chapters
[15:02:24] scan: chap 1 c=0->0, b=0->211390 (211391), 692076 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 2 c=1->1, b=211391->211395 (5), 1000 ms
[15:02:24] scan: aspect = 0
[15:02:24] scan: scanning title 4
[15:02:24] scan: opening IFO for VTS 4
[15:02:24] pgc_id: 1, pgn: 1: pgc: 0xf075a0
[15:02:24] scan: vts=4, ttn=1, cells=0->1, blocks=0->286149, 286150 blocks
[15:02:24] scan: duration is 00:15:36 (936053 ms)
[15:02:24] scan: checking audio 1
[15:02:24] scan: id=80bd, lang=English (AC3), 3cc=eng ext=0
[15:02:24] scan: title 4 has 2 chapters
[15:02:24] scan: chap 1 c=0->0, b=0->286144 (286145), 935052 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 2 c=1->1, b=286145->286149 (5), 1000 ms
[15:02:24] scan: aspect = 0
[15:02:24] scan: scanning title 5
[15:02:24] scan: opening IFO for VTS 5
[15:02:24] pgc_id: 1, pgn: 1: pgc: 0xf07700
[15:02:24] scan: vts=5, ttn=1, cells=0->4, blocks=0->123453, 123454 blocks
[15:02:24] scan: duration is 00:07:03 (423276 ms)
[15:02:24] scan: checking audio 1
[15:02:24] scan: id=80bd, lang=English (AC3), 3cc=eng ext=0
[15:02:24] scan: title 5 has 5 chapters
[15:02:24] scan: chap 1 c=0->0, b=0->39465 (39466), 135282 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 2 c=1->1, b=39466->85804 (46339), 153544 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 3 c=2->2, b=85805->113912 (28108), 95388 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 4 c=3->3, b=113913->123448 (9536), 38058 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 5 c=4->4, b=123449->123453 (5), 1001 ms
[15:02:24] scan: aspect = 0
[15:02:24] scan: scanning title 6
[15:02:24] scan: opening IFO for VTS 6
[15:02:24] pgc_id: 1, pgn: 1: pgc: 0xf077e0
[15:02:24] scan: vts=6, ttn=1, cells=0->1, blocks=0->49231, 49232 blocks
[15:02:24] scan: duration is 00:03:03 (183010 ms)
[15:02:24] scan: checking audio 1
[15:02:24] scan: id=80bd, lang=English (AC3), 3cc=eng ext=0
[15:02:24] scan: title 6 has 2 chapters
[15:02:24] scan: chap 1 c=0->0, b=0->49226 (49227), 182010 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 2 c=1->1, b=49227->49231 (5), 1000 ms
[15:02:24] scan: aspect = 0
[15:02:24] scan: scanning title 7
[15:02:24] scan: opening IFO for VTS 7
[15:02:24] pgc_id: 1, pgn: 1: pgc: 0xf07900
[15:02:24] scan: vts=7, ttn=1, cells=0->1, blocks=0->10522, 10523 blocks
[15:02:24] scan: duration is 00:00:37 (37210 ms)
[15:02:24] scan: checking audio 1
[15:02:24] scan: id=80bd, lang=English (AC3), 3cc=eng ext=0
[15:02:24] scan: title 7 has 2 chapters
[15:02:24] scan: chap 1 c=0->0, b=0->10517 (10518), 36210 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 2 c=1->1, b=10518->10522 (5), 1000 ms
[15:02:24] scan: aspect = 0
[15:02:24] scan: scanning title 8
[15:02:24] scan: opening IFO for VTS 8
[15:02:24] pgc_id: 1, pgn: 1: pgc: 0xf07a20
[15:02:24] scan: vts=8, ttn=1, cells=0->1, blocks=0->6063, 6064 blocks
[15:02:24] scan: duration is 00:00:20 (20166 ms)
[15:02:24] scan: checking audio 1
[15:02:24] scan: id=80bd, lang=English (AC3), 3cc=eng ext=0
[15:02:24] scan: checking audio 2
[15:02:24] scan: id=89bd, lang=English (DTS), 3cc=eng ext=0
[15:02:24] scan: title 8 has 2 chapters
[15:02:24] scan: chap 1 c=0->0, b=0->6058 (6059), 19166 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 2 c=1->1, b=6059->6063 (5), 1000 ms
[15:02:24] scan: aspect = 0
[15:02:24] scan: scanning title 9
[15:02:24] scan: opening IFO for VTS 9
[15:02:24] pgc_id: 1, pgn: 1: pgc: 0xf07b40
[15:02:24] scan: vts=9, ttn=1, cells=0->1, blocks=0->9762, 9763 blocks
[15:02:24] scan: duration is 00:00:24 (24000 ms)
[15:02:24] scan: checking audio 1
[15:02:24] scan: id=80bd, lang=English (AC3), 3cc=eng ext=0
[15:02:24] scan: checking audio 2
[15:02:24] scan: id=89bd, lang=English (DTS), 3cc=eng ext=0
[15:02:24] scan: title 9 has 2 chapters
[15:02:24] scan: chap 1 c=0->0, b=0->9757 (9758), 23000 ms
[15:02:24] scan: chap 2 c=1->1, b=9758->9762 (5), 1000 ms
[15:02:24] scan: aspect = 0
[15:02:24] scan: scanning title 10
[15:02:24] scan: opening IFO for VTS 10
libdvdread: Invalid IFO for title 10 (VTS_10_0.BUP).
ERROR: scan: ifoOpen failed
[15:02:24] scan: scanning title 11
[15:02:24] scan: opening IFO for VTS 10
libdvdread: Invalid IFO for title 10 (VTS_10_0.BUP).
ERROR: scan: ifoOpen failed
[15:02:24] scan: decoding previews for title 1
[15:02:24] scan: audio 0x89bd: DCA, rate=48000Hz, bitrate=768000 English (DTS) (5.1 ch)
[15:02:24] scan: audio 0x80bd: AC-3, rate=48000Hz, bitrate=448000 English (AC3) (5.1 ch)
[15:02:24] scan: audio 0x82bd: AC-3, rate=48000Hz, bitrate=384000 Francais (AC3) (5.1 ch)
[15:02:24] scan: audio 0x83bd: AC-3, rate=48000Hz, bitrate=192000 English (AC3) (Director's Commentary 1) (Dolby Surround)
Scanning title 1 of 11...
Scanning title 1 of 11...
[15:02:25] scan: 10 previews, 720x480, 23.976 fps, autocrop = 6/14/0/0, aspect 16:9, PAR 32:27
[15:02:25] scan: decoding previews for title 2
[15:02:25] scan: audio 0x80bd: AC-3, rate=48000Hz, bitrate=192000 English (AC3) (2.0 ch)
[15:02:25] 70.517464s: Film -> Video
Scanning title 2 of 11...
[15:02:25] scan: 10 previews, 720x480, 29.970 fps, autocrop = 102/104/2/0, aspect 4:3, PAR 8:9
[15:02:25] scan: decoding previews for title 3
[15:02:25] scan: audio 0x80bd: AC-3, rate=48000Hz, bitrate=192000 English (AC3) (2.0 ch)
[15:02:25] scan: 10 previews, 720x480, 29.970 fps, autocrop = 64/66/2/4, aspect 4:3, PAR 8:9
[15:02:25] scan: decoding previews for title 4
[15:02:25] scan: audio 0x80bd: AC-3, rate=48000Hz, bitrate=192000 English (AC3) (2.0 ch)
Scanning title 4 of 11...
[15:02:25] scan: 10 previews, 720x480, 29.970 fps, autocrop = 0/4/0/2, aspect 4:3, PAR 8:9
[15:02:25] scan: decoding previews for title 5
[15:02:25] scan: audio 0x80bd: AC-3, rate=48000Hz, bitrate=192000 English (AC3) (2.0 ch)
[15:02:25] 41.421734s: Video -> Film
Scanning title 5 of 11...
[15:02:26] scan: 10 previews, 720x480, 23.976 fps, autocrop = 16/36/8/6, aspect 4:3, PAR 8:9
[15:02:26] scan: decoding previews for title 6
[15:02:26] scan: audio 0x80bd: AC-3, rate=48000Hz, bitrate=192000 English (AC3) (2.0 ch)
[15:02:26] scan: 10 previews, 720x480, 23.976 fps, autocrop = 64/68/4/4, aspect 4:3, PAR 8:9
[15:02:26] scan: decoding previews for title 7
[15:02:26] scan: audio 0x80bd: AC-3, rate=48000Hz, bitrate=192000 English (AC3) (2.0 ch)
[15:02:26] 8.855866s: Film -> Video
Scanning title 7 of 11...
[15:02:26] scan: 10 previews, 720x480, 29.970 fps, autocrop = 0/0/0/0, aspect 4:3, PAR 8:9
[15:02:26] scan: decoding previews for title 8
[15:02:26] scan: audio 0x89bd: DCA, rate=48000Hz, bitrate=1536000 English (DTS) (5.1 ch)
[15:02:26] scan: audio 0x80bd: AC-3, rate=48000Hz, bitrate=192000 English (AC3) (Dolby Surround)
Scanning title 8 of 11...
[15:02:26] scan: 10 previews, 720x480, 29.970 fps, autocrop = 58/62/0/2, aspect 16:9, PAR 32:27
[15:02:26] scan: decoding previews for title 9
[15:02:26] scan: audio 0x89bd: DCA, rate=48000Hz, bitrate=768000 English (DTS) (5.1 ch)
[15:02:26] scan: audio 0x80bd: AC-3, rate=48000Hz, bitrate=448000 English (AC3) (5.1 ch)
[15:02:26] scan: 10 previews, 720x480, 29.970 fps, autocrop = 0/0/2/4, aspect 16:9, PAR 32:27
[15:02:26] scan: title (0) job->width:720, job->height:384
[15:02:26] scan: title (1) job->width:640, job->height:272
[15:02:26] scan: title (2) job->width:640, job->height:352
[15:02:26] scan: title (3) job->width:640, job->height:480
[15:02:26] scan: title (4) job->width:640, job->height:432
[15:02:26] scan: title (5) job->width:640, job->height:352
[15:02:26] scan: title (6) job->width:640, job->height:480
[15:02:26] scan: title (7) job->width:720, job->height:304
[15:02:26] scan: title (8) job->width:720, job->height:416
[15:02:26] libhb: scan thread found 9 valid title(s)
Searching for longest title...
 + Title (0) index 1 has length 6461sec
 + Title (1) index 2 has length 354sec
 + Title (2) index 3 has length 693sec
 + Title (3) index 4 has length 936sec
 + Title (4) index 5 has length 423sec
 + Title (5) index 6 has length 183sec
 + Title (6) index 7 has length 37sec
 + Title (7) index 8 has length 20sec
 + Title (8) index 9 has length 24sec
Found longest title, setting title to 1
+ title 1:
  + vts 1, ttn 1, cells 0->21 (3315693 blocks)
  + duration: 01:47:41
  + size: 720x480, aspect: 1.78, 23.976 fps
  + autocrop: 6/14/0/0
  + chapters:
    + 1: cells 0->0, 122470 blocks, duration 00:03:41
    + 2: cells 1->1, 224077 blocks, duration 00:06:48
    + 3: cells 2->2, 93024 blocks, duration 00:02:54
    + 4: cells 3->3, 132108 blocks, duration 00:04:11
    + 5: cells 4->4, 64232 blocks, duration 00:01:57
    + 6: cells 5->5, 174946 blocks, duration 00:05:36
    + 7: cells 6->6, 91159 blocks, duration 00:02:48
    + 8: cells 7->7, 233133 blocks, duration 00:07:08
    + 9: cells 8->8, 248372 blocks, duration 00:07:58
    + 10: cells 9->9, 196150 blocks, duration 00:06:22
    + 11: cells 10->10, 85895 blocks, duration 00:02:44
    + 12: cells 11->11, 228240 blocks, duration 00:07:10
    + 13: cells 12->12, 116047 blocks, duration 00:03:28
    + 14: cells 13->14, 395425 blocks, duration 00:12:57
    + 15: cells 15->15, 167486 blocks, duration 00:05:37
    + 16: cells 16->16, 84667 blocks, duration 00:02:54
    + 17: cells 17->17, 223006 blocks, duration 00:07:23
    + 18: cells 18->18, 123780 blocks, duration 00:04:07
    + 19: cells 19->19, 239858 blocks, duration 00:08:13
    + 20: cells 20->20, 71613 blocks, duration 00:03:41
    + 21: cells 21->21, 5 blocks, duration 00:00:01
  + audio tracks:
    + 1, English (AC3) (5.1 ch), 48000Hz, 448000bps
    + 2, English (DTS) (5.1 ch), 48000Hz, 768000bps
    + 3, Francais (AC3) (5.1 ch), 48000Hz, 384000bps
    + 4, English (AC3) (Director's Commentary 1) (Dolby Surround), 48000Hz, 192000bps
  + subtitle tracks:
    + 1, English (iso639-2: eng)
    + 2, Espanol (iso639-2: spa)
    + 3, Francais (iso639-2: fra)
Invalid sample rate 0, using input rate 48000
[15:02:26] 1 job(s) to process
[15:02:26] starting job
[15:02:26] job configuration:
[15:02:26]  * source
[15:02:26]    + /Users/Joel/Movies/BatchRip/Eternal Sunshine
[15:02:26]    + title 1, chapter(s) 1 to 21
[15:02:26]  * destination
[15:02:26]    + /Users/Joel/Movies/movie.mp4
[15:02:26]    + container: MPEG-4 (.mp4 and .m4v)
[15:02:26]      + chapter markers
[15:02:26]  * video track
[15:02:26]    + decoder: mpeg2
[15:02:26]      + bitrate 9800 kbps
[15:02:26]    + frame rate: same as source (around 23.976 fps)
[15:02:26]    + loose anamorphic
[15:02:26]      + storage dimensions: 720 * 480 -> 720 * 464, crop 6/14/0/0
[15:02:26]      + pixel aspect ratio: 43 / 36
[15:02:26]      + display dimensions: 860 * 464
[15:02:26]    + encoder: x264
[15:02:26]      + options: level=30:cabac=0:ref=3:mixed-refs=1:analyse=all:me=umh:no-fast-pskip=1
[15:02:26]      + quality: 0.59
[15:02:26]  * audio track 0
[15:02:26]    + name: Downmixed
[15:02:26]    + decoder: English (AC3) (5.1 ch) (track 1, id 80bd)
[15:02:26]      + bitrate: 448 kbps, samplerate: 48000 Hz
[15:02:26]    + mixdown: Dolby Pro Logic II
[15:02:26]    + dynamic range compression: 1.500000
[15:02:26]    + encoder: faac
[15:02:26]      + bitrate: 160 kbps, samplerate: 48000 Hz
[15:02:26]  * audio track 1
[15:02:26]    + name: Surround
[15:02:26]    + decoder: English (AC3) (5.1 ch) (track 1, id 80bd)
[15:02:26]      + bitrate: 448 kbps, samplerate: 48000 Hz
[15:02:26]    + AC3 passthrough
[15:02:26]  * audio track 2
[15:02:26]    + name: Commentary
[15:02:26]    + decoder: English (AC3) (Director's Commentary 1) (Dolby Surround) (track 4, id 83bd)
[15:02:26]      + bitrate: 192 kbps, samplerate: 48000 Hz
[15:02:26]    + mixdown: Stereo
[15:02:26]    + dynamic range compression: 1.250000
[15:02:26]    + encoder: faac
[15:02:26]      + bitrate: 64 kbps, samplerate: 48000 Hz
[15:02:26] encx264: keyint-min: 24, keyint-max: 240
[15:02:26] encx264: encoding with stored aspect 43/36
[15:02:26] encx264: Encoding at constant RF 20.910002
x264 [info]: using SAR=43/36
x264 [info]: using cpu capabilities: MMX2 SSE2Fast SSSE3 Cache64
x264 [info]: profile Baseline, level 3.0
No accelerated IMDCT transform found
No accelerated IMDCT transform found
No accelerated IMDCT transform found
[15:02:26] sync: expecting 154937 video frames
[15:02:26] reader: first SCR 146
[15:02:26] a52_syncinfo failed
[15:02:26] a52_syncinfo failed
[15:02:26] a52_syncinfo failed
[15:02:26] a52_syncinfo ok
[15:02:26] a52_syncinfo ok
[15:02:26] a52_syncinfo ok
[15:02:26] mpeg2: "Chapter 1" (1) at frame 0 time 3003
[15:02:26] sync: first pts is 3003
[15:02:27] 0.658978s: Video -> Film
[15:02:27] sync: video time didn't advance - dropped 10 frames (delta 325 ms, current 42042, next 42792, dur 750)



cvk_b
Veteran User
Posts: 527
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2007 2:11 am

Extra Audio Tracks on Apple TV 2.3

Post by cvk_b »

Apple has never given up any info on how the files are 'supposed to be' when using more than 2 audio tracks. Have you tried aac,ac3,ac3 ( the commentary being ac3)?

iJoel
Regular User
Posts: 124
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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by iJoel »

cvk_b wrote:Apple has never given up any info on how the files are 'supposed to be' when using more than 2 audio tracks. Have you tried aac,ac3,ac3 ( the commentary being ac3)?
I see. Good thing I'm a huge fan of REing anything I can haha ;).
So far I've tried aac,ac3,aac only, but I will try aac,ac3,ac3 next.
I'll do that later tonight, in fact, and I'll let you know ^__^.

Thanks for your help.

iJoel
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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by iJoel »

Okay, so I tried another encode (after the first two previously mentioned);
with the format aac,ac3,ac3. But I also changed ALL of the names to non-default
ones. So I have "Downmixed" (DPLII), "True Surround" (AC3), and "Commentary" (AC3),
and this actually works. It allows me to select any of the three and it will keep the same
audio track selected throughout stopping/resuming.

But I'm unsure whether this has to do with me renaming the tracks, or if it has to do with
ac3. So I'm going to need to do some more encoding to test that out ^__-.

One note of interest:
The order was this on the AppleTV:

-English (True Surround)
-English (Commentary)
-English (Downmixed)

but in all other players (like iTunes) it was in the Correct order - "Downmixed", "True Surround", "Commentary".

eddyg
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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by eddyg »

Keep on experimenting and sharing your results.

The nirvana is when we can have AAC/AC3 for main with autoselection of AAC/AC3 and then manual selection of additional tracks, whether they be AC3 or AAC.

Cheers, Ed.

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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by eddyg »

iJoel wrote:Okay, so I tried another encode (after the first two previously mentioned);
with the format aac,ac3,ac3. But I also changed ALL of the names to non-default
ones. So I have "Downmixed" (DPLII), "True Surround" (AC3), and "Commentary" (AC3),
and this actually works. It allows me to select any of the three and it will keep the same
audio track selected throughout stopping/resuming.
What did it default to when playing initially? Did it select the "True Surround" one (like we would wish)?

What if you change the ATV settings to not want DD, then what does it select?

Good work on this - hopefully we'll have a recipe that we can use, since I too would like to start including the directors commentary.

Cheers, Ed.

cvk_b
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More than 2 audio tracks on Apple TV

Post by cvk_b »

Currently I am encoding like this (but am unsure if it is "correct").
  • 1• AAC lang=foo1 name=bar
    2• AC3 lang=foo1 name=bar2
    3• AC3 lang=foo2 name=bar3
    4• AC3 lang=foo3 name=bar4
etc.,

When foo2 or foo3 are the same language as foo1 ( such as commentary ), I change the language(s) with the 'set language patch' in the dev forum. From testing, I think they need to be unique to work correctly. This needs MUCH more testing, however, so if anybody has input...

Also, If I want to "optimize for streaming" I do it with mp4v2 trunk (mp4file tool) from googlecode because HB 0.9.3 hoses the audio track names when they are set and optimize is also selected.

iJoel
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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by iJoel »

eddyg wrote:
iJoel wrote:Okay, so I tried another encode (after the first two previously mentioned);
with the format aac,ac3,ac3. But I also changed ALL of the names to non-default
ones. So I have "Downmixed" (DPLII), "True Surround" (AC3), and "Commentary" (AC3),
and this actually works. It allows me to select any of the three and it will keep the same
audio track selected throughout stopping/resuming.
What did it default to when playing initially? Did it select the "True Surround" one (like we would wish)?

What if you change the ATV settings to not want DD, then what does it select?

Good work on this - hopefully we'll have a recipe that we can use, since I too would like to start including the directors commentary.

Cheers, Ed.

Well I don't have a surround system setup (yet) so it default-ed to the downmixed one.
But I do have the dolby digital setting to "on" in the settings though.
But I'm guessing since I don't have the cable hooked up and instead have component cables
hooked up to it thats why xP.


But I haven't been doing as many tests as I'd like with this.
So there's many more that I'm going to do.

But after initially testing. All english tracks + all named.
AAC, AC3, AAC = Does not work
AAC, AC3, AC3 = Works perfectly, but is not ideal because the commentary track doesn't need the high bitrate of AC3.
AAC, AAC = Not Tested, but isn't what I'm after anyway.

Now I threw other languages and tracks as follows;
1 = English (AC3)
2 = English (DTS)
3 = French (AC3)
4 = Commentary (AC3)

In CLI format;
-a 1,1,4,2,3 -A "Downmixed","True Surround","Commentary","Eng DTS", "Teh French" -E faac,ac3,faac,faac,faac -B 160,auto,64,64,64 -R 48,Auto,48,48,48 -6 dpl2,auto,dpl2,dpl2,dpl2 -D 1.5,1.0,1.25,1.25,1.25

Doing that shows up like this in the AppleTV:
English
English (Downmixed)
English (Commentary)
English (Eng DTS)
French

& it defaults to the French language track no matter what I do.
But after starting

Which leads me to conclude;
-The AppleTV NEEDS all tracks to be named in order to retain the correct settings.
-But the ATV only uses ALL of the tracks names in certain circumstances.
-There can't be only 1 of anything (either language or format, unless the format is AC3 & there are >1 AC3 tracks in the file) or the ATV won't use the "name" for the track even if there is one.
-So there needs to be more than 1 AC3 audio track in the file in order for it to work with multiple tracks.
-There also needs to be more than 1 of each language (unless it's just an AC3 track of a single language, and there's >1 AC3 tracks in the file) or it won't work.

IF the requirements aren't fufilled like I stated than (at least in my case, since I don't have a surround system, but I leave dolby surround ON in the settings as it doesn't seem to effect anything)
then the ATV will play the LAST AAC track found in the file (regardless of it's name or language). Note: could be the last AC3 track in the file if you have a surround system, but I can't test that.

Note: I need to do more testing on the ATV's dependencies on language/format. So I'll post back with more results later, so some or all of this info could be wrong as it's only based on 5 files.
& I also have no idea how it orders the tracks either, since it's not in alphabetical, not numerical, not even by file size (of the track) so I really have no idea haha.


cvk_b wrote:Currently I am encoding like this (but am unsure if it is "correct").
  • 1• AAC lang=foo1 name=bar
    2• AC3 lang=foo1 name=bar2
    3• AC3 lang=foo2 name=bar3
    4• AC3 lang=foo3 name=bar4
etc.,

When foo2 or foo3 are the same language as foo1 ( such as commentary ), I change the language(s) with the 'set language patch' in the dev forum. From testing, I think they need to be unique to work correctly. This needs MUCH more testing, however, so if anybody has input...

Also, If I want to "optimize for streaming" I do it with mp4v2 trunk (mp4file tool) from googlecode because HB 0.9.3 hoses the audio track names when they are set and optimize is also selected.
You have ATV 2.3 right?
My AAC,AC3,AC3 file worked perfectly as well.
But there were all the same language (English).

So I have a question.
Do all the names appear on your audio selection list?
Even if you have an AC3 of only one language?
Like say English (AAC) "Downmixed", English (AC3) "True Surround", Commentary (AC3) "English", French (AC3) "Teh French".

Would you see all the names on your AppleTV (bar1,bar2,bar3,bar4).
And what order do they display in?

Good idea about the language patch.
I'll have to look for it and use it in my testing as well ^__^

Now off to test a few other things :D

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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by cvk_b »

I am starting to think that audio track groups should be set differently. Apple's logic is "Alternate track groups are collections of tracks that represent some conceptual data but are appropriate for use in different play environments." ( http://bit.ly/cKsO ). Correct me if I'm wrong but *all* HB's audio streams are in the same group ID. Shouldn't all AAC streams be grouped/separated from AC3 streams? Currently, things only work with 1 of each type stream, such as the ATV preset. Things get all screwy when you add more audio tracks, either type. I have been doing LOTS of testing on the atv this weekend.

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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by iJoel »

cvk_b wrote:I am starting to think that audio track groups should be set differently. Apple's logic is "Alternate track groups are collections of tracks that represent some conceptual data but are appropriate for use in different play environments." ( http://bit.ly/cKsO ). Correct me if I'm wrong but *all* HB's audio streams are in the same group ID. Shouldn't all AAC streams be grouped/separated from AC3 streams? Currently, things only work with 1 of each type stream, such as the ATV preset. Things get all screwy when you add more audio tracks, either type. I have been doing LOTS of testing on the atv this weekend.
Or maybe AAC/AC3 groups paired, and seperated otherwise. ;P

jbrjake
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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by jbrjake »

cvk_b wrote:I am starting to think that audio track groups should be set differently. Apple's logic is "Alternate track groups are collections of tracks that represent some conceptual data but are appropriate for use in different play environments." ( http://bit.ly/cKsO ). Correct me if I'm wrong but *all* HB's audio streams are in the same group ID. Shouldn't all AAC streams be grouped/separated from AC3 streams?.
....but the point of putting AAC and AC3 in the same group is that they *are* a "collection of tracks that represent some conceptual data but are appropriate for use in different play environments." -- those environments being stereo and surround playback environments.

A better suggestion would be to group tracks from the same source audio track in the same alt group, no? (What iJoel is saying)

cvk_b
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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by cvk_b »

jbrjake wrote:
cvk_b wrote:I am starting to think that audio track groups should be set differently. Apple's logic is "Alternate track groups are collections of tracks that represent some conceptual data but are appropriate for use in different play environments." ( http://bit.ly/cKsO ). Correct me if I'm wrong but *all* HB's audio streams are in the same group ID. Shouldn't all AAC streams be grouped/separated from AC3 streams?.
....but the point of putting AAC and AC3 in the same group is that they *are* a "collection of tracks that represent some conceptual data but are appropriate for use in different play environments." -- those environments being stereo and surround playback environments.

A better suggestion would be to group tracks from the same source audio track in the same alt group, no? (What iJoel is saying)
That's what makes logical sense. However I'm trying to figure out what my stupid apple devices want. The track order when displayed on the apple tv is mixed up and the default track is not observed correctly (when more than 2 tracks). Maybe it should be grouped by source audio track, maybe by language, maybe by type of track (stereo vs surround), maybe by stream ( aac vs ac3 ). It's gonna take an army of testing to figure out what makes things right on all apple devices at once. But I do think it's possible, and when someone stumbles upon it I think everything will suddenly fall in place.

There's other weirdness going on too. I've been doing all my testing with 6 audio tracks (1aac,5ac3) and various languages and audio track names. Right now, qt won't even play the files unless they have the extension m4v*. AppleTV interprets the language 'undefined' as OFF (even says on atv menu) and I'm starting to think that the only languages that can be in appletv files are the ones listed in the appletv language menu (not confirmed). I need to reduce the variables. Any suggestions welcome.

*don't know if this is expected or not, *.mp4 won't play

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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by realityking »

A while back when iTunes was first able to choose between multiple audio tracks we found that they had to be one of those mentioned in the iTunes preferences or they won't work. I wouldn't be surprised if the same is true for the AppleTV.

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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by eddyg »

iJoel wrote:
cvk_b wrote:I am starting to think that audio track groups should be set differently. Apple's logic is "Alternate track groups are collections of tracks that represent some conceptual data but are appropriate for use in different play environments." ( http://bit.ly/cKsO ). Correct me if I'm wrong but *all* HB's audio streams are in the same group ID. Shouldn't all AAC streams be grouped/separated from AC3 streams? Currently, things only work with 1 of each type stream, such as the ATV preset. Things get all screwy when you add more audio tracks, either type. I have been doing LOTS of testing on the atv this weekend.
Or maybe AAC/AC3 groups paired, and seperated otherwise. ;P
Intetesting ideas - worth trying

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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by iJoel »

eddyg wrote:
iJoel wrote:
cvk_b wrote:I am starting to think that audio track groups should be set differently. Apple's logic is "Alternate track groups are collections of tracks that represent some conceptual data but are appropriate for use in different play environments." ( http://bit.ly/cKsO ). Correct me if I'm wrong but *all* HB's audio streams are in the same group ID. Shouldn't all AAC streams be grouped/separated from AC3 streams? Currently, things only work with 1 of each type stream, such as the ATV preset. Things get all screwy when you add more audio tracks, either type. I have been doing LOTS of testing on the atv this weekend.
Or maybe AAC/AC3 groups paired, and seperated otherwise. ;P
Intetesting ideas - worth trying
Got myself a nice box of mp4s, and an "MP4box" ;P to test all this stuff out.
So hopefully it'll shed some light on things. :D

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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by realityking »

I doubt having multiple alternate groups is going to work, a testfile of mine showed that the second AG gets ignored by both the QuickTime Player and iTunes (don't have an AppleTV to test). I've had in each AG two tracks, one AC3 and one AAC. The first AG had the english tracks, the second the german tracks.

KonaBlend
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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by KonaBlend »

My impression of alternate_group (AG) is that it is in effect a mutual-exclusion group.

Let's take a contrived example; source material with 1 audio-main track in 3 language variants { eng, french, spanish } and 1 commentary track, again with 3 language variants { eng, french, spanish }, all audio tracks in AC3 with one exception: audio-main also has english in DTS.

The user then desires to retain AC3 when possible for all things audio-main. The user doesn't care for AC3 on commentary when language is not english. The user also wants AAC for all tracks for best MP4 compatibility. The user is also experimenting with DTS source track.

As I understand it, we should end up with two AG... i'll pick a random number for each AG instead of starting to count from 1.

AG = 88: audio-main group --> 9 audio tracks
w/ AC3 english (pass-thru)
w/ AC3 french (pass-thru)
w/ AC3 spanish (pass-thru)
w/ AAC english (source: AC3 english)
w/ AAC french (source: AC3 french)
w/ AAC spanish (source: AC3 spanish)
w/ AC3 english (source: DTS track, higher bitrate than standard AC3)
w/ AAC english (source: DTS track, higher bitrate than standard AAC)
w/ AAC english (source: DTS track, lossless)

AG = 99: audio-commentary group --> 4 audio tracks
w/ AC3 english
w/ AAC english
w/ AAC french
w/ AAC spanish

And order should not matter except that it might be safer to assume when the player ultimately comes down to a decision that is neutral, maybe it's fall-back is to choose then one with lowest track-index or track-id. Lots of if's on this one as it's speculation without testing -- I do not have an AppleTV.

Please note this is a contrived example only meant to describe AG groupings.

KonaBlend
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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by KonaBlend »

fyi, mp4v2 trunk@248 now has support for editing the following with mp4track:
  • enabled
    inMovie
    inPreview
    layer
    alternateGroup
    volume
    width
    height
    language
    handlerName
    userDataName
The documentation for mp4track has some more details on those fields and can be found here.

iJoel
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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by iJoel »

realityking wrote:I doubt having multiple alternate groups is going to work, a testfile of mine showed that the second AG gets ignored by both the QuickTime Player and iTunes (don't have an AppleTV to test). I've had in each AG two tracks, one AC3 and one AAC. The first AG had the english tracks, the second the german tracks.
I see, so even if it did, magically happen to work with the ATV, it'd be worthless on other platforms.
KonaBlend wrote:fyi, mp4v2 trunk@248 now has support for editing the following with mp4track:
  • enabled
    inMovie
    inPreview
    layer
    alternateGroup
    volume
    width
    height
    language
    handlerName
    userDataName
The documentation for mp4track has some more details on those fields and can be found here.
Thanks ;P.
I'll use this for the test files I make then.
& nice info on alternate groups.
I'll take it into consideration when I encode the test files ^__^.

iJoel
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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by iJoel »

I haven't tested the AG theory yet.
But i forgot to mention earlier that in my last testing;
there was some correlation between the ordering of tracks in the ATV.

It goes like this.

-All AC3 tracks (somewhat paired with their AAC)
-All AAC tracks (somewhat paired with their AC3)

8 tracks:

-English [Surround Main]
-French -supposed to be named "Surround French"
-English [Surround Commentary]
-English [Surround DTS]
-English [Downmixed Main]
-French [Downmixed French]
-English [Downmixed Commentary]
-English [Downmixed DTS]

There were encoded -a 1,1,2,2,3,3,4,4, -e faac,ac3,faac,ac3,faac,ac3,faac,ac3
where
1=English (AC3)
2=English (DTS)
3=Francais (AC3)
4=English (Commentary) (AC3)

They're not in any coherent order, but thy do pair up with each other (aac/ac3 tracks)
like Downmixed Main & Surround Main are both the first track in their specific categories/formats.
& Downmixed French & Surround French are both the second track, etc.

And the French AC3 track doesn''t get named because it's the only AC3 track in it's language
which makes the audio default to the "Downmixed English" track when initially played no matter what I
do.

So as it seems, AAC tracks get named if there's more than one of it's language (no matter the format) [based on other testing],
AC3 tracks get named if there is another AC3 track with it's same language, and the AppleTV defaults to a particular track
(of which I can't seem to determine) if all tracks aren't named (when there's >2 tracks), and the conditions above arn't met.

Anyone care to test more to confirm?
^__^

Now on, to mess with AGs ;P.

cvk_b
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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by cvk_b »

Audio 2 dts to ac3 ?

iJoel
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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by iJoel »

cvk_b wrote:Audio 2 dts to ac3 ?
Haha, I know. It was done in the cli on accident.
as I was just referencing tracks as numbers & naming them "Source 1 DM"; "Source 1 Sur", etc.
Didn't even realize there was a dts track in there until i wrote the above post (as i needed to make the track names more readable so i checked them),
but although obviously the track doesn't work at all, probably errored out, it's still referenced in the file which was all i really wanted, cause all I was testing was when and under what conditions did the ATV display track names (cause that seems to be the only way that the ATV will honor audio track settings, if all track names are displayed).

But I'll find another dvd with >=4 tracks, no dts and test again xP.

iJoel
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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by iJoel »

Okay, okay.
Now Alternate Groups don't do much.
But they do something.

iTunes:
-seems to disregard alternate groups altogether and display
audio tracks in regards to [sort by track id, then sort by audio language (overwriting the sorting by track-id, but it uses the lowest track-id of whatever language to determine what goes first,second, third, etc), and then sort as AAC+AC3 (I think ;P)]

Quicktime:
-looks at the lowest track-id of whatever audio format/language & then displays only the alternate groups with that id & in some random ordering of which I don't really care to decipher ;P.

AppleTV:
-At first I thought it acted like Quicktime, but it's different. In only one sense so far, and that is it looks at the first (lowest) audio track and then decides by that the rest of the tracks it will display. BUT, if the first track is different then all the rest (>2 tracks) then it displays the rest of the tracks. Sorted in the same way as usual [AC3 Tracks (lowest to highest id), AAC Tracks (lowest to highest id)], but the way it decides it's default track get's changed, but I haven't figured that much out yet ha.


Anyone else doing any testing?
I have a lot more to do, but I thought I'd report something.
Right now, I'm writing a front-end to MP4Track (from mp4v2) to make all of this easier ;P.
When I'm done with that, this will go a lot faster ha.

iJoel
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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by iJoel »

I haven't REed much after the above post,
life's been a little hectic lately, but I thought I'd
mention my solution to the whole point of creating this post originally haha.

I solved my DVD audio problems
by ripping all of the audio tracks from DVD to MP4 (the ones I wanted, in either format) and then afterwards changing
the alternative groups of the audio tracks in ways that
would "hide" them (as mentioned above) from the ATV+Quicktime+iPhone (as to keep compatibility for those devices, but still work
perfectly in iTunes+VLC+others). The beauty of the solution means I can encode everything all the
audio tracks I want on all of my DVDs now with what I want them to have. And as soon as I'm done REing the way the
AppleTV+Quicktime+iPhone likes to handle multiple audio track M4Vs, I can convert all my
files in one fell swoop without re-encoding.

So anyone with the same problem could do that as well,
but I'm working on
eddyg wrote: The nirvana is when we can have AAC/AC3 for main with autoselection of AAC/AC3 and then manual selection of additional tracks, whether they be AC3 or AAC.
Cheers, Ed.
So I'll post back here when I achieve that, or similar.

cvk_b
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Re: AppleTV: Always defaults to "Commentary" audio track?

Post by cvk_b »

iJoel wrote:I haven't REed much after the above post,
life's been a little hectic lately, but I thought I'd
mention my solution to the whole point of creating this post originally haha.

I solved my DVD audio problems
by ripping all of the audio tracks from DVD to MP4 (the ones I wanted, in either format) and then afterwards changing
the alternative groups of the audio tracks in ways that
would "hide" them (as mentioned above) from the ATV+Quicktime+iPhone (as to keep compatibility for those devices, but still work
perfectly in iTunes+VLC+others). The beauty of the solution means I can encode everything all the
audio tracks I want on all of my DVDs now with what I want them to have. And as soon as I'm done REing the way the
AppleTV+Quicktime+iPhone likes to handle multiple audio track M4Vs, I can convert all my
files in one fell swoop without re-encoding.

So anyone with the same problem could do that as well,
but I'm working on

eddyg wrote:
The nirvana is when we can have AAC/AC3 for main with autoselection of AAC/AC3 and then manual selection of additional tracks, whether they be AC3 or AAC.
Cheers, Ed.


So I'll post back here when I achieve that, or similar.


Interesting solution. I look forward to following your progress.

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