Updated Apple TV Specs!?

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cbud
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Updated Apple TV Specs!?

Post by cbud » Wed Mar 21, 2007 8:22 pm

This is what the Apple TV spec page says about supported video.




H.264 and protected H.264 (from iTunes Store): Up to 5 Mbps, Progressive Main Profile (CAVLC) with AAC-LC audio up to 160 Kbps (maximum resolution: 1280 by 720 pixels at 24 fps, 960 by 540 pixels at 30 fps)

iTunes Store purchased video: 320 by 240 pixels or 640 by 480 pixels
MPEG-4: Up to 3 Mbps, Simple Profile with AAC-LC audio up to 160 Kbps (maximum resolution: 720 by 432 pixels at 30 fps)

Audio formats supported
AAC (16 to 320 Kbps); protected AAC (from iTunes Store); MP3 (16 to 320 Kbps); MP3 VBR; Apple Lossless; AIFF; WAV

Photos formats supported
JPEG, BMP, GIF, TIFF, PNG

cbud
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Post by cbud » Wed Mar 21, 2007 8:23 pm

CAVLC? Does that mean no CABAC?

cbud
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Post by cbud » Wed Mar 21, 2007 8:24 pm

Can only handle 160 kbs of audio! Not looking good for 5.1 AAC.

jbrjake
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Post by jbrjake » Wed Mar 21, 2007 8:27 pm

Yeah we discussed this stuff on IRC earlier today.

Depressing specs, I agree =(

You're right, it seems no CABAC, and with the audio bitrate so low AAC 5.1 isn't a possibility without AAC-HE....which Apple doesn't support.

At least there's an explanation for why the Export to Apple TV QT component includes 960*540 dimensions in its innards; for playing 30fps content at half-rez hd video...

cbud
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Post by cbud » Wed Mar 21, 2007 8:40 pm

By not supporting CABAC and B-Frames does that mean @TV won't play those videos at all or will it just not turn that stuff on?

What is the point of using Main Profile over Baseline if one is not going to use CABAC or B-Frames?

jbrjake
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Post by jbrjake » Wed Mar 21, 2007 9:27 pm

cbud wrote:By not supporting CABAC and B-Frames does that mean @TV won't play those videos at all or will it just not turn that stuff on?
I believe it won't play CABAC videos at all.

It *does* seem to support 1 b-frame, in the Quicktime Export component. And if @tv works like QuickTime Player, it'll handle more b-frames than that, as long as adaptive b-frames are turned off.
What is the point of using Main Profile over Baseline
That is the question of the hour. It seems utterly pointless. No CABAC, no MBAFF...why bother with Main? dynaflash thinks they've got software updates planned down the line, like when 640*480 got unlocked on the ipod 5g. I think that's optimistic, though.

The other big question is, wtf is the bitrate limited so heavily? 5Mbps is fine for most content, sure, but why such tough limits? They're not following the standard. Again. First level of h.264 to support 720p is Level 3.1. But that has a max bitrate of 14Mbps, not 5. And why such a low audio bitrate?

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Post by rhester » Wed Mar 21, 2007 11:38 pm

jbrjake wrote:That is the question of the hour. It seems utterly pointless. No CABAC, no MBAFF...why bother with Main? dynaflash thinks they've got software updates planned down the line, like when 640*480 got unlocked on the ipod 5g. I think that's optimistic, though.
I don't think baseline offers a level at the higher resolution they are supporting, so they were forced. I reserve the right to be wrong. :)

Rodney

sidechain
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Post by sidechain » Thu Mar 22, 2007 5:14 am

cbud wrote:Can only handle 160 kbs of audio! Not looking good for 5.1 AAC.
I've got 600 movies ripped @ 192 and another 100 @ 256

I sure pray that they will play. I am not ripping a single movie till I get that sucker hooked up.

Anamonde
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Post by Anamonde » Thu Mar 22, 2007 6:04 am

hopefully they mean 160kbps per channel of audio....
I am not sure what AAC-LC implies so I could be talking rubbish.

dynaflash
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Post by dynaflash » Thu Mar 22, 2007 6:13 pm

Anamonde wrote:hopefully they mean 160kbps per channel of audio....
I am not sure what AAC-LC implies so I could be talking rubbish.
Well, an HB user over on the irc channel was good enought to run some tests for us with his appleTV he just got!

Turns out videos with an audio bitrate of 320kbps played just fine and sounded good, according to his tests. As well, he was able to get surround sound out of our latest svn. Whether or not he was getting downmixed dolby pro logic or in fact, six discreet channels we are still trying to determine, but to be sure, better results than we hoped for at least!

mike693
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Post by mike693 » Thu Mar 22, 2007 6:55 pm

dynaflash wrote:Well, an HB user over on the irc channel was good enought to run some tests for us with his appleTV he just got!
No uuid issues?

I am eager to know what HB video settings (esp. x264) are confirmed to work on the AppleTV, as well.

Cyander
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Post by Cyander » Thu Mar 22, 2007 7:54 pm

mike693 wrote:
dynaflash wrote:Well, an HB user over on the irc channel was good enought to run some tests for us with his appleTV he just got!
No uuid issues?
Nope
mike693 wrote: I am eager to know what HB video settings (esp. x264) are confirmed to work on the AppleTV, as well.
x264 Main *or* Baseline work
Using 5.1 AAC, it plays, so even if it is pro logic, I can rip to 5.1 and it won't be broken.
I have tried up to about 1700Kbps, but I don't see why higher rates won't work
The Anamorphic setting is /ignored/ by Apple TV, unfortunately.

I also tried two of my 720p rips from a Blu-Ray disc on it.
5.5Mbps avg bitrate for the video stream - It worked out of the box

Chapter tracks work, even in a .mov file, making skipping around nice.

cbud
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Post by cbud » Thu Mar 22, 2007 8:40 pm

The .mov files with chapter tracks, they have no artwork, correct?

Cyander
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Post by Cyander » Thu Mar 22, 2007 10:12 pm

I haven't tried adding artwork to a .mov file before, but if you add the artwork to it in iTunes (and it sticks), it should display on the Apple TV.

The device is turning out to be a bit better than I expected. IMO.

cbud
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Post by cbud » Thu Mar 22, 2007 10:24 pm

Cyander wrote:I haven't tried adding artwork to a .mov file before, but if you add the artwork to it in iTunes (and it sticks), it should display on the Apple TV.

The device is turning out to be a bit better than I expected. IMO.
Yeah, I don't think you can add it to a mov file with chapter tracks. Just wondering if you found a way around that.

Cyander
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Post by Cyander » Thu Mar 22, 2007 10:57 pm

When getting info on the movie in iTunes, it won't have an artwork tab?

cbud
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Post by cbud » Thu Mar 22, 2007 11:03 pm

Cyander wrote:When getting info on the movie in iTunes, it won't have an artwork tab?
That is what I am asking you. I have added chapters to an MP4 and wrapped it a .mov container. The chapters work fine, but I am unable to add Artwork. The tab is there, but I cannot drag and drop the image. I was wondering if the same is true for you.

scaife
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Post by scaife » Fri Mar 23, 2007 5:07 am

When the 5.1 audio track plays on the Apple TV, does it output discrete channels or stereo?

And wtf is up with the god-awful TV show sorting? It's almost a deal-breaker IMO...

mike693
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Post by mike693 » Fri Mar 23, 2007 5:52 am

Cyander wrote:
mike693 wrote:
dynaflash wrote:Well, an HB user over on the irc channel was good enought to run some tests for us with his appleTV he just got!
No uuid issues?
Nope
mike693 wrote: I am eager to know what HB video settings (esp. x264) are confirmed to work on the AppleTV, as well.
x264 Main *or* Baseline work
Using 5.1 AAC, it plays, so even if it is pro logic, I can rip to 5.1 and it won't be broken.
I have tried up to about 1700Kbps, but I don't see why higher rates won't work
The Anamorphic setting is /ignored/ by Apple TV, unfortunately.

I also tried two of my 720p rips from a Blu-Ray disc on it.
5.5Mbps avg bitrate for the video stream - It worked out of the box

Chapter tracks work, even in a .mov file, making skipping around nice.
Thanks, Cyander. That's all I needed to hear. I went out and picked one up at the local Apple store today. I haven't tested methodically, but all my HB rips have worked so far. The "worst" I threw at it today was: x264 Main, 160k stereo AAC, 720x416, 2pass, 3.5mbps. I suppose I can start safely ripping to 5.1! Woohoo!

gswhite
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Post by gswhite » Fri Mar 23, 2007 3:54 pm

Cyander wrote:
mike693 wrote:
dynaflash wrote:Well, an HB user over on the irc channel was good enought to run some tests for us with his appleTV he just got!
No uuid issues?
Nope
mike693 wrote: I am eager to know what HB video settings (esp. x264) are confirmed to work on the AppleTV, as well.
x264 Main *or* Baseline work
Using 5.1 AAC, it plays, so even if it is pro logic, I can rip to 5.1 and it won't be broken.
I have tried up to about 1700Kbps, but I don't see why higher rates won't work
The Anamorphic setting is /ignored/ by Apple TV, unfortunately.

I also tried two of my 720p rips from a Blu-Ray disc on it.
5.5Mbps avg bitrate for the video stream - It worked out of the box

Chapter tracks work, even in a .mov file, making skipping around nice.
Your saying Apple TV Supports MOV files? So it would support 5.1 then as MOV is a wrapper for audio + video?

Am I incorrect, please slap me if I am talking rubbish? ;)

Anamonde
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Post by Anamonde » Fri Mar 23, 2007 6:02 pm

My appleTV seams to play all my old handbrake rips - waiting on the new 5.1 support to see if it plays correctly.... seams to play the trailers right.

in other news:
http://www.engadget.com/2007/03/23/appl ... d-support/

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