H.265 10-bit RF16 Slow is not giving sufficient quality

Discuss encoding for devices and presets.
Forum rules
An Activity Log is required for support requests. Please read How-to get an activity log? for details on how and why this should be provided.
Post Reply
Daxelinho
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2020 7:49 pm

H.265 10-bit RF16 Slow is not giving sufficient quality

Post by Daxelinho »

I'm a beginner and want to encode my bluray in a quality where there's basically no difference between the original and the encode.
For this example I use Kingsman: Secret Service Full HD Bluray.
But even at RF16 the quality is still noticeable worse, not as sharp and not as many details.
Tbf: You only really see it if you compare frame by frame but the feeling sticks in my head and I just want to delete the remux. I know myself and if the quality is not as good (in a reasonable range) as the remux, I will watch the remux nonetheless and the whole encoding procedure to save space is useless.

Relevant settings are the following:

Filters: Everything is "Off"

Video:
  • Coded: H.265 10-bit (x265)
  • Quality: Constant Quality: 16 RF
  • Preset: Slow
  • Tune: None
  • Profile and Level: Auto
  • Advanced Options: None
Maybe on of you guys with more experience and knowledge know how I can improve the quality.
I added a visual comparison between the Bluray-Remux and the Encode, aswell as the used settings, at the end.
In my opinion it is most visible in the light cast of the window in the top right and the damaged wall on the left.
I mean, perhaps I'm too sensitive (most probably) but maybe there's a way for me to improve it.

Visuals: Imgur "Image comparison Remux - H.265 10-bit RF16 Slow"


OS: Windows 10 x64
Version: 1.3.3 (2020061300)
Woodstock
Veteran User
Posts: 3753
Joined: Tue Aug 27, 2013 6:39 am

Re: H.265 10-bit RF16 Slow is not giving sufficient quality

Post by Woodstock »

The only way to get "no difference" is to not re-encode. The video was already encoded once going to the BD; you cannot get back what was lost in that encode.

You might try doing the encodes in x264 rather than x265; the benefits of h265 encoding are small at 1080p or less, unless you're shooting for low bitrates... which will destroy the video quality anyway. x264 is a more mature encoder, too.
Daxelinho
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2020 7:49 pm

Re: H.265 10-bit RF16 Slow is not giving sufficient quality

Post by Daxelinho »

I know, there has to be some kind of reduction in the video itself but I wan't to see it as little as possible
Maybe there's a way to tweak the settings? Encoder Tune or Filters, maybe advanced options? I don't know. :D

I mean, the movie itself could be a little bit hard to efficiently encode.
May I ask what your preset for 1080p Bluray content is if you have one?

What Settings do you suggest in h264? 10-bit aswell?
mduell
Veteran User
Posts: 7191
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 8:54 pm

Re: H.265 10-bit RF16 Slow is not giving sufficient quality

Post by mduell »

Pixel peeping will always find differences in a new lossy encode. If it's not obvious as you watch the movie, why does it matter?

If it still matters, stick with the source video instead.
musicvid
Veteran User
Posts: 3679
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2009 1:19 am

Re: H.265 10-bit RF16 Slow is not giving sufficient quality

Post by musicvid »

Also, encoding to x264 as Woodstock recommends will revert to 8 bit, as is your BluRay native depth.
Doing this alone may clean up some collateral shadow noise from the sample conversion, minimizing some of your quality concerns.
Woodstock
Veteran User
Posts: 3753
Joined: Tue Aug 27, 2013 6:39 am

Re: H.265 10-bit RF16 Slow is not giving sufficient quality

Post by Woodstock »

I use command line encoding, but the settings are based on an older "HQ" preset from the GUI. No 10-bit stuff for me.

But, I'm also known as a bit of a curmudgeon, in that I feel if I'm checking a movie for minor encoding artifacts, I'm obviously bored with the actual content, so why not move on to something else? I'm not getting paid to do that...
musicvid
Veteran User
Posts: 3679
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2009 1:19 am

Re: H.265 10-bit RF16 Slow is not giving sufficient quality

Post by musicvid »

To me, it's the difference between pixel-peeping, and having something jump out at me.
In the case of the shadow noise from bit depth upconversion, it was the latter that got me interested. Of course, I got bored with the content long before, maybe never...
FlaTechNole21
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Apr 20, 2020 8:59 pm

Re: H.265 10-bit RF16 Slow is not giving sufficient quality

Post by FlaTechNole21 »

For x265 10-bit I recommend adding the following in the Advanced Options:
aq-mode=2:strong-intra-smoothing=0:sao=0

AQ Mode 2 is optimized for 10-bit and disabling intra smoothing and SAO allows for more detail to be retained (especially in lower resolutions).

FYI, for x265 8-bit I recommend the following in Advanced Options:
aq-mode=1:sao=0

AQ Mode 1 is optimized for 8-bit. Enabling/Disabling strong-intra-smoothing is up to you. I usually disable it, but it can prevent banding artifacts in 8-bit outputs.
Post Reply