what settings for old DVD encode(deinterlace filters, etc.)

General questions or discussion about HandBrake, Video and/or audio transcoding, trends etc.
Post Reply
ryzenuser
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2018 3:41 pm

what settings for old DVD encode(deinterlace filters, etc.)

Post by ryzenuser » Mon Oct 15, 2018 4:09 pm

Description of problem or question:
Hello everyone, I am trying to rip an old dvd(480p SD quality, VOB files) in mkv but I'm having a few questions regarding deinterlace, detelecine and other settings. I want to achieve high quality and small file size(~1300 avg kbps but using CRF for better quality) by using the slow or slower x264 preset, High Profile. My questions are the following(hope the mediainfo code below helps)(in descending order of importance if you dont have the time to answer them all):
1) is it better to leave video interlaced and the simply let vlc/mpc automatically deinterlace or should I encode with deinterlace?
2) Does the video need deinterlace and if so is decomb good at default settings? I want to achieve high quality and wouldn't mind using a slower but higher quality option. Should i use the EEDI2bob preset for decomb or something else or should i use yadif and if so which preset offers best quality?
3) does the video need detelecine?
4) when hoping for small file size should i use level 3 or 3.1 for small file size but high quality?
5) Is there any meaningful difference in quality when using slower instead of slow preset?(despite the lower encoding speed)
6) should i set it at constant or variable frame rate mode (same as source)?(will be using PC for playback so probably wont have compatibility issues)
7) Will the encode benefit(or worsen quality)by using a x264 tune(film)? It is an old 90s movie, real life footage with no CGI and moderate grain.
8) what audio mixdown should i choose in order to maintain original channels(at AAC 192 kbps)?
9) do general HQ and super HQ presets produce better results than MKV presets(modified to match preset and CRF value as general HQ preset)? Does the extra options: "ref=5:bframes=5" offer better quality in the super HQ preset?

Thanks for your help and I'm sorry for the inundation of questions. :)

HandBrake version (e.g., 1.0.0):
1.1.2
Operating system and version (e.g., Ubuntu 16.04 LTS, macOS 10.13 High Sierra, Windows 10 Creators Update):
Windows 10
Video information

Code: Select all

General
Format                      : MPEG-PS
Overall bit rate mode       : Constant
Overall bit rate            : 7 025 kb/s

Video
Format                      : MPEG Video
Format version              : Version 2
Format profile              : Main@Main
Format settings             : CustomMatrix / BVOP
Format settings, BVOP       : Yes
Format settings, Matrix     : Custom
Format settings, GOP        : Variable
Format settings, picture st : Frame
Bit rate mode               : Constant
Bit rate                    : 6 500 kb/s
Width                       : 720 pixels
Height                      : 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio        : 4:3
Frame rate                  : 29.970 (30000/1001) FPS
Standard                    : NTSC
Color space                 : YUV
Chroma subsampling          : 4:2:0
Bit depth                   : 8 bits
Scan type                   : Interlaced
Scan order                  : Top Field First
Compression mode            : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)          : 0.628
Time code source            : Group of pictures header
GOP, Open/Closed            : Open
GOP, Open/Closed of first f : Closed

Audio
Format                      : AC-3
Format/Info                 : Audio Coding 3
Commercial name             : Dolby Digital
Muxing mode                 : DVD-Video
Bit rate mode               : Constant
Bit rate                    : 384 kb/s
Channel(s)                  : 5 channels
Channel layout              : L R C Ls Rs
Sampling rate               : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate                  : 31.250 FPS (1536 SPF)
Bit depth                   : 16 bits
Compression mode            : Lossy
Stream size                 : 56.0 MiB (5%)
Service kind                : Complete Main
Last edited by ryzenuser on Mon Oct 15, 2018 4:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Woodstock
Veteran User
Posts: 2753
Joined: Tue Aug 27, 2013 6:39 am

Re: Best settings for old DVD encode(deinterlace filters, etc.)

Post by Woodstock » Mon Oct 15, 2018 4:36 pm

"Best" is highly subjective. Best in what way?

Are there specific issues you have with the results of the DVD-oriented presets, like "HQ 480p30 Surround" or "Super HQ 480p30 Surround"?

ryzenuser
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2018 3:41 pm

Re: what settings for old DVD encode(deinterlace filters, etc.)

Post by ryzenuser » Mon Oct 15, 2018 4:46 pm

Woodstock wrote:
Mon Oct 15, 2018 4:36 pm
"Best" is highly subjective. Best in what way?

Are there specific issues you have with the results of the DVD-oriented presets, like "HQ 480p30 Surround" or "Super HQ 480p30 Surround"?
What I mean is that when I used decomb to deinterlace interlaced content it didn't work very well(it resulted in poor quality and interlaced frames were still noticeable many times when watching the encoded result. Are there "best" settings when deinterlacing to achieve better/higher quality results? Which is best, decomb or yadif, or decomb with EEDI2bob? However, my other questions are in need of answering as well so perhaps the word best doesn't accurately describe my situation.
The default presets (HQ or Super HQ 480p) unfortunately have many undesirable settings that don't meet my needs. Also, I am experimenting in achieving results best suited to my likes by using diferent settings

rollin_eng
Veteran User
Posts: 2876
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 11:06 pm

Re: what settings for old DVD encode(deinterlace filters, etc.)

Post by rollin_eng » Mon Oct 15, 2018 4:49 pm

Could you please post your HB logs, instructions can be found here:

https://handbrake.fr/docs/en/latest/hel ... y-log.html

ryzenuser
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2018 3:41 pm

Re: what settings for old DVD encode(deinterlace filters, etc.)

Post by ryzenuser » Mon Oct 15, 2018 5:01 pm

rollin_eng wrote:
Mon Oct 15, 2018 4:49 pm
Could you please post your HB logs, instructions can be found here:

https://handbrake.fr/docs/en/latest/hel ... y-log.html
I haven't encoded the video in question yet and other times that I encountered problems I delete the logs afterwards.
But anyway, the reason I created this thread isn't troubleshooting but instead if you could give me tips about encoding the video(generally all videos), essentially I'm looking for answers to my questions based on the MediaInfo I provided(if you could give them), I think I was clear about that, otherwise I wouldn't post so many questions.

User avatar
JohnAStebbins
HandBrake Team
Posts: 5214
Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2008 7:21 pm

Re: what settings for old DVD encode(deinterlace filters, etc.)

Post by JohnAStebbins » Mon Oct 15, 2018 6:07 pm

For most users, decomb default is "best". If you are having issues with that, we need to dive down deeper into your particular problems. This requires an activity log.

As an example, if you are encoding interlaced content with lots of motion throughout the entire video, decomb's automatic detection of interlaced frames is just going to be computational overhead that you don't need since the majority of frames are likely to have comb artefacts. On the other hand, if your content is more slow paced, decomb will identify frames that do not need to be deinterlaced and skip applying that filter to those frames. This results in better quality since any deinterlace filter (including EEDI2) will result in loss of quality of the frames it is being applied to.

To expand more on the whole "best" is subjective theme. Every setting has trade-offs. I don't particularly care a lot about file size. I have 80TB to burn. So "best" settings for me are usually settings that result in larger files. We don't know what criteria you would use to describe "best". So it's difficult to answer your question without going into a full discussion of all the trade-offs involved with every setting.

User avatar
JohnAStebbins
HandBrake Team
Posts: 5214
Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2008 7:21 pm

Re: what settings for old DVD encode(deinterlace filters, etc.)

Post by JohnAStebbins » Mon Oct 15, 2018 6:30 pm

To answer some of your questions more directly.
  1. It's better to deinterlace (if required) while transcoding. You can use higher quality deinterlacer druing non-realtime transcoding than you could use during realtime playback.
  2. Maybe. Some DVDs are soft telecined throughout the entire video. This type would not need to be deinterlaced. But this begs the question, how do you know if your DVD is soft telecined throughout the entire video? You can't really be certain, which is why we created the decomb filter.
  3. Maybe. Some DVDs are hard telecined. This type requires the detelicine filter. The detelecine filter only works on hard telecined NTSC video. If the video comes from an original source that was 24 fps and the DVD framerate is detected as 30 fps, it may be hard telecined. Or it may be a really bad interlaced transfer.
  4. Level is meaningless on it's own. Level defines a set of features the encoder can use. It is meant to be used to limit the features used in order to ensure compatibility with specific playback software or hardware. Use "Auto" if you have no such hardware or software limitations.
  5. Depends on your definition of "meaningful". I never use anything slower than "medium" because the quality difference is not "meaningful" to me.
  6. If your player supports variable framerate, use variable. If you think you may want to play the video on potentially broken players that don't support variable framerate, use constant. DVDs are inherently variable framerate. The DVD spec only supports 30fps framerate signalling (or 25 fps for PAL). But they use video stream tags that allow them to repeat fields in order to extend the duration of frames. This is how soft telecine works. The video is "30 fps" but certain frames have their duration extended with field repeat flags to produce an average framerate of 24 fps. I've seen DVDs that will toggle back and forth between sequences that are pure 30 fps and sequences that are 24 fps soft telecine.
  7. Maybe. Depends on the characteristics of the particular video you are encoding.
  8. Use audio passthru if you can ("Auto-passthru"). Set the audio fallback encoder to whatever your playback environment supports and set the mixdown for the fallback encoder to the highest available option for that encoder.
  9. Maybe. Depends on the characteristics of the particular video you are encoding.

ryzenuser
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2018 3:41 pm

Re: what settings for old DVD encode(deinterlace filters, etc.)

Post by ryzenuser » Mon Oct 15, 2018 7:02 pm

Thank you very much for your answers, they have been very helpful and gave me a better insight of deinterlace. Is there any good complete guide/tutorial that explains thoroughly handbrake's(or video encoding in general) filters and settings(deinterlace, detelecine, bframes, presets, CRF, etc.)? Unfortunately, handbrake official documentation although easy to understand doesn't offer thorough and complete information regarding encoding stuff.

Post Reply