Not so much 4K video compatible.

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pbarker1701
Posts: 38
Joined: Sun May 17, 2020 7:59 am

Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by pbarker1701 »

I will give those settings a try. I use MakeMKV to do the initial burn into mkv from hard media.
I do transcoding into iTunes compatible m4v files with Handbrake, then go straight to AppleTV.
I tried using plex but it didn't handle TV programs properly for me (kept wanting to treat them as movies which made them a [Censored] to find).
For me, the simpler the interface, the better and plex was anything but simple.
I have been using a different program for transcoding 4K UHD mkv files into mp4 because of the time and quality issues I've been having with Handbrake.
My only issue with that program is it has hit or miss subtitle handling.

Thanks for the info. I'll give it try and let you know how it goes.
archer75
Posts: 22
Joined: Sun Jan 17, 2010 5:42 pm

Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by archer75 »

pbarker1701 wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 9:57 am I will give those settings a try. I use MakeMKV to do the initial burn into mkv from hard media.
I do transcoding into iTunes compatible m4v files with Handbrake, then go straight to AppleTV.
I tried using plex but it didn't handle TV programs properly for me (kept wanting to treat them as movies which made them a [Censored] to find).
For me, the simpler the interface, the better and plex was anything but simple.
I have been using a different program for transcoding 4K UHD mkv files into mp4 because of the time and quality issues I've been having with Handbrake.
My only issue with that program is it has hit or miss subtitle handling.

Thanks for the info. I'll give it try and let you know how it goes.
I use makemkv as well.
For the ATV4k, set your video format to 4k SDR. Then turn on match framerate and match range.

Your plex wasn't configured correctly as it's mixing tv shows and movies. You have to have them in their own folders. And then set one plex folder to the tv show folder AND tell plex that's tv shows in that folder. Then it only lists them as shows and grabs the correct metadata for them. You also have to have the correct folder structure and naming conventions.
I have a tv shows folder for my current shows. A saved tv folder for shows i've watched but want to keep. A folder for kids movies. One for all 1080 movies and another for all 4k movies. Works flawlessly. I've run plex for over a decade on both several PC's and macs. No issues.
I have my tv show aspect of it all automated too. But we'd have to take that discussion elsewhere.

I really don't think your issue are the transcodes. I think it's something related to playback.

What is the model number of your AVR? Your TV? How do you have everything connected? What cables are you using?

I do have screenshots of my handbrake settings I can post but I need to figure out image hosting first as what I was using previously is no longer working. But I start with the Matroska 2160/60 preset and then edit that and save as my new profile. For subs I have it burn in forced subtitles only. I don't keep separate sub files. For audio I keep the original HD audio track only.
I have it auto crop. And use MKV. So I only really edit the video tab.
Video Codec: h.265 10bit
Framerate: same as source - Variable framerate
Encoder preset: fast
encoder tune: none
encoder profile: main 10
Advanced options: strong-intra-smoothing=0:rect=0
Constant quality: 18 for 1080, 16 for 4k. I'll sometimes tweak this depending on file size or what i'm encoding.
pbarker1701
Posts: 38
Joined: Sun May 17, 2020 7:59 am

Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by pbarker1701 »

I have a current ATV 4K 64Gig. I've tried it both 4K HDR and SDR, both with match frame rate and match range.
Didn't seem to make any difference.
My TV is a Samsung 4K 58", circa 2019.

I wish iTunes recognized mkv format but it doesn't so I have to convert to either m4v via Handbrake or to mp4 via a different transcoding program.
My biggest issues with Handbrake right now is that it tends to wash out the colors when it converts a 4K UHD mkv file.

Doesn't the Matroska preset 2160/60 just go from one mkv file to another? That won't do much for me since I need iTunes compatible files.
I will also occasionally copy the movie file onto either an iPad or a Windows laptop, so those formats all have to play nice with each other, which typically means m4v or mp4.
I'm trying a test transcode of Marvel's The Avengers (my favorite movie to test with because I can tell right away about color issues and the subtitles show up about 15 minutes into the flick, so I don't have to do the whole film to find out if it will do what I need.)

I'll let you know how things go.

Thanks for all your help so far.
rollin_eng
Veteran User
Posts: 3604
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 11:06 pm

Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by rollin_eng »

Have you tried remuxing rather than converting your video?
pbarker1701
Posts: 38
Joined: Sun May 17, 2020 7:59 am

Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by pbarker1701 »

I'm going to try a second session with the additional setting you gave me and see how things turn out.
pbarker1701
Posts: 38
Joined: Sun May 17, 2020 7:59 am

Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by pbarker1701 »

Not sure how to do remuxing.
archer75
Posts: 22
Joined: Sun Jan 17, 2010 5:42 pm

Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by archer75 »

pbarker1701 wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:22 pm I have a current ATV 4K 64Gig. I've tried it both 4K HDR and SDR, both with match frame rate and match range.
Didn't seem to make any difference.
My TV is a Samsung 4K 58", circa 2019.

I wish iTunes recognized mkv format but it doesn't so I have to convert to either m4v via Handbrake or to mp4 via a different transcoding program.
My biggest issues with Handbrake right now is that it tends to wash out the colors when it converts a 4K UHD mkv file.

Doesn't the Matroska preset 2160/60 just go from one mkv file to another? That won't do much for me since I need iTunes compatible files.
I will also occasionally copy the movie file onto either an iPad or a Windows laptop, so those formats all have to play nice with each other, which typically means m4v or mp4.
I'm trying a test transcode of Marvel's The Avengers (my favorite movie to test with because I can tell right away about color issues and the subtitles show up about 15 minutes into the flick, so I don't have to do the whole film to find out if it will do what I need.)

I'll let you know how things go.

Thanks for all your help so far.
The issue is most likely that itunes doesn't support what you're trying to do. Which is why you should ditch itunes. You can setup plex server faster than it takes to download and install. It's very easy. And would help with troubleshooting. Even if only for a single movie. You could even play directly to plex on your samsung to bypass everything and see how it goes.

Also for the purpose of testing, leave the apple tv video format at 4k SDR.

Handbrake isn't washing out the colors. The washed out look is due to something not supporting HDR. Probably itunes. Or something in your video chain.

We'd need to know the model of your TV and AVR(you did say you have a AVR?) and how it's all connected. Not everything supports HDR which might be the issue.

Have you watched other content on your ATV4k? 4k with HDR? Such as netflix(with the 4k plan) or amazon or something else? Any issues there?
rollin_eng
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Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 11:06 pm

Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by rollin_eng »

You could just remux your files into a mp4/m4v container without converting them.

XMediaRecode, ffmpeg and mp4box can do this I believe.
rollin_eng
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Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 11:06 pm

Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by rollin_eng »

It’s my understanding that HB does not support HDR due to the 8 bit pipeline.

Perhaps a dev can confirm/deny?
archer75
Posts: 22
Joined: Sun Jan 17, 2010 5:42 pm

Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by archer75 »

rollin_eng wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:38 pm It’s my understanding that HB does not support HDR due to the 8 bit pipeline.

Perhaps a dev can confirm/deny?
It works. I have hundreds of 4k encodes that all have working HDR.
rollin_eng
Veteran User
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Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by rollin_eng »

archer75 wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:54 pm
rollin_eng wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:38 pm It’s my understanding that HB does not support HDR due to the 8 bit pipeline.

Perhaps a dev can confirm/deny?
It works. I have hundreds of 4k encodes that all have working HDR.
As HB has an 8 bit pipeline I believe you are not getting “true” HDR.
archer75
Posts: 22
Joined: Sun Jan 17, 2010 5:42 pm

Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by archer75 »

rollin_eng wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 7:51 pm
archer75 wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:54 pm
rollin_eng wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:38 pm It’s my understanding that HB does not support HDR due to the 8 bit pipeline.

Perhaps a dev can confirm/deny?
It works. I have hundreds of 4k encodes that all have working HDR.
As HB has an 8 bit pipeline I believe you are not getting “true” HDR.
triggers HDR on my TV. I've done comparisons against the disc. It certainly looks "true". I can't see a difference.
mduell
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Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by mduell »

Can't tell the difference tells you how little 10 bit/HDR really is worth. It's more style than capability for most users.
pbarker1701
Posts: 38
Joined: Sun May 17, 2020 7:59 am

Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by pbarker1701 »

Since you asked, my AVR is a Sony STR-DH790, which does support 4K HDR10.
archer75
Posts: 22
Joined: Sun Jan 17, 2010 5:42 pm

Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by archer75 »

pbarker1701 wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 5:21 am Since you asked, my AVR is a Sony STR-DH790, which does support 4K HDR10.
and you've played other 4k videos with HDR through the ATV connected to that Sony without issue?
pbarker1701
Posts: 38
Joined: Sun May 17, 2020 7:59 am

Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by pbarker1701 »

Just completed my first test using the setting you gave me and it worked PERFECTLY! Took about 14-15 hours for a full transcode but the picture quality is excellent and the subtitles are exactly where they should be. Am doing a second test with another 4K UHD film (The Martian) and will see how that goes tomorrow when it's done.

Thanks for your help and advice.

Mahalo!
pbarker1701
Posts: 38
Joined: Sun May 17, 2020 7:59 am

Re: Not so much 4K video compatible.

Post by pbarker1701 »

Just finished checking out The Martian - Extended version. Colors are great. Subtitles show up exactly where they should be. Much smaller file then what
I had previously as well. I expect the same results with the Theatrical version.

Once again, thanks a bunch for your help.

Now I get to re-do ALL my 4K films. Given the amount of space I'll get back, it will be worth it.
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