DTS source audio support

Archive of historical development discussions
Discussions / Development has moved to GitHub
Forum rules
*******************************
Please be aware we are now using GitHub for issue tracking and feature requests.
- This section of the forum is now closed to new topics.

*******************************
golias
Regular User
Posts: 105
Joined: Wed Jan 03, 2007 7:29 pm

Post by golias »

Any chance that a DTS "pass through" mode will ever happen with a future build of HB?

Hard drive storage has gotten so cheap, I frankly don't care in the slightest about the space savings which AAC offers anymore. What would make me the most happy is to preserve all discrete channel data, whether from Dolby 5.1 or from DTS. I'm sure I'm not the only out out there who feels that way.
cvk_b
Veteran User
Posts: 527
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2007 2:11 am

Post by cvk_b »

golias wrote:Any chance that a DTS "pass through" mode will ever happen with a future build of HB?

Hard drive storage has gotten so cheap, I frankly don't care in the slightest about the space savings which AAC offers anymore. What would make me the most happy is to preserve all discrete channel data, whether from Dolby 5.1 or from DTS. I'm sure I'm not the only out out there who feels that way.
Request ReadMe wrote:For 1.0:

• Zero-cell detection (HandBrake will notice when a DVD breaks formatting as a DRM measure, so you know to use DVD2OneX)
• Better preview frames, so you can more easily detect interlacing artifacts.
• A better deinterlacing method
• Encode individual .vobs or .ts files instead of a whole VIDEO_TS directory
• Chapters in output .mp4 movies, derived from DVD chapter lengths
• Matroska (.mkv) support
• Soft subtitles (.srt or VobSub)
DTS audio pass-thru (like the AC3 pass-thru we already have)
• PSP support
• Cowon A2 support
• More exact cropping
• Import MeGUI profiles
• High definition support (this is very tentative)
• Better looking dock progress
• Audio normalization
It will be great to have, I agree.
jbrjake
Veteran User
Posts: 4805
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:38 am

Post by jbrjake »

Err like it says at the top of that README, for the latest info go to the Trac. When maurj picked up the DTS ticket, I moved it to 0.8.5 and the description got changed. I know he was looking at doing pass-thru, but I seem to remember he ran into a hurdle of some sort that made him put it off til later. Or maybe just a lack of time--he hasn't been around much lately, so he's probably busy doing other stuff.

In the end, DTS pass-thru isn't very useful. I mean, I want it too, but I don't consider it a priority in any sense. Only a handful of DTS titles use the full 1.5mbps bitrate. Most DTS titles are hybrids using 756kbps DTS paired with a 448kbps AC3 track. It's generally held that DTS only shines when you give it the full 1.5mbps. At half-bitrate, it won't sound any better than the AC3. In such cases, you're better off using the lower bitrate AC3 that will sound the same.
golias
Regular User
Posts: 105
Joined: Wed Jan 03, 2007 7:29 pm

Post by golias »

jbrjake wrote:Err like it says at the top of that README, for the latest info go to the Trac. When maurj picked up the DTS ticket, I moved it to 0.8.5 and the description got changed. I know he was looking at doing pass-thru, but I seem to remember he ran into a hurdle of some sort that made him put it off til later. Or maybe just a lack of time--he hasn't been around much lately, so he's probably busy doing other stuff.

In the end, DTS pass-thru isn't very useful. I mean, I want it too, but I don't consider it a priority in any sense. Only a handful of DTS titles use the full 1.5mbps bitrate. Most DTS titles are hybrids using 756kbps DTS paired with a 448kbps AC3 track. It's generally held that DTS only shines when you give it the full 1.5mbps. At half-bitrate, it won't sound any better than the AC3. In such cases, you're better off using the lower bitrate AC3 that will sound the same.
Okay, well not everybody is an old hand at navigating through Trac. I've accessed it a few times before for various projects, and I *still* don't completely get it... so I'm sorry if that was a "n00b" question, but there's no need to shove an "RTFA" all the way up my nose.

On the vast majority of my DTS disks, it's using the full bit-rate (and in fact must put the DTS version on its own disk to make it happen.) I paid extra for the high-quality DTS on those disks; why would I want to give it up?

On those that don't, DTS is often the only discrete surround-sound option, and sometimes it's even the only option at all. (For example the original Japanese language track for the entire Samurai Champloo 7-DVD series is DTS-only. Each disk has 3 tracks: English DD 5.1, English Stereo, Japanese DTS.)

So no, I'm never "better off" using AC3 on any of my DTS disks. I seriously doubt I'm the only one in such a position.

DTS pass-through and non-transluscent subtitles are the only two items on the road map holding me back from converting my entire DVD collection to media files. I'm bouncing with glee at the thought that these two features may soon show up in my favorite (by a long shot) DVD file converter app.
jbrjake
Veteran User
Posts: 4805
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:38 am

Post by jbrjake »

golias wrote:I'm sorry if that was a "n00b" question, but there's no need to shove an "RTFA" all the way up my nose.
Uh, I was just pointing out that the source cvk_b cited wasn't up to date...
On the vast majority of my DTS disks, it's using the full bit-rate (and in fact must put the DTS version on its own disk to make it happen.) I paid extra for the high-quality DTS on those disks; why would I want to give it up?
You shouldn't, but that doesn't invalidate my point, which is that the vast majority of DVDs with DTS tracks only have half-bitrate ones. Your quality discs are, sadly, pretty rare. You're not the only one in that situation, but it's not exactly affecting the entire user base.
So no, I'm never "better off" using AC3 on any of my DTS disks. I seriously doubt I'm the only one in such a position.
Well I wasn't talking about your situation. I said "In such cases, you're better off using" the AC3, and by "such cases" I was referring to "hybrids using 756kbps DTS paired with a 448kbps AC3 track"...as in, when you have more than one choice of discrete surround sound. Not discs where an audio source is only available in DTS.
golias
Regular User
Posts: 105
Joined: Wed Jan 03, 2007 7:29 pm

Post by golias »

jbrjake wrote: Uh, I was just pointing out that the source cvk_b cited wasn't up to date...
Sorry. I misunderstood what you were saying.

Given that I'm not the only one asking, it seems that you could be underestimating how many people are hoping for this feature. Maybe there are a lot of badly-implemented DTS disks out there. I haven't seen one like what you are talking about, so I couldn't say.

But if DTS support is going to be offered at all, it might as well be done right. Downmixing it to stereo and/or Pro-Logic is better than nothing, but it seems a shame. Especially since (as others on this forum have pointed out) some of DTS disks have a stereo-only AC-3 track to make the disk minimally compliant with all playback systems, meaning the only way to get discrete 5.1 is by preserving the DTS signal.

It might not be that important to some people, but to those who own DTS disks and surround sound systems, it kinda sucks to have three speakers you took the trouble to pay for and set up remain unused (or used less than optimally). That, or give up on being able to convert part of your ripped DVD library.
Post Reply