General question out to all iTunes, iPod, aTV, etc users...
Since encodes for the aTV can't be put on an iPod, and you really don't want iPod encodes on your 60" TV....how do you segregate them in iTunes? Do you do both? If so, do you just rename them or do you use some sort of tag (like a word in the comments field) to organize them and ensure proper syncing.
Thanks,
Brian
iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
This very issue drove me crazy... I hated having 2 entries in my iTunes Library for the same movie. At first, I would still do two encodes (one for each device), and only copy the iPhone encode into my database when I wanted to sync that particular movie (using the command-key drag to not copy the file into the library directory, only create symlink).
This worked, but I really grew tired of doing 2 encodes, so I decided to try and develop a preset that worked on both devices, but still looked good on my HDTV. This meant throwing out advanced x264 features like CABAC and bframes, but I think I have found a middle-ground that I an content with. The files are a little big for my limited iPhone storage (really need a 32GB+ model released soon), but I'm only doing 1 encode.
I've posted my preset elsewhere on this forum... promised to update it recently, but haven't had the time. Maybe I'll do that tonight...
This worked, but I really grew tired of doing 2 encodes, so I decided to try and develop a preset that worked on both devices, but still looked good on my HDTV. This meant throwing out advanced x264 features like CABAC and bframes, but I think I have found a middle-ground that I an content with. The files are a little big for my limited iPhone storage (really need a 32GB+ model released soon), but I'm only doing 1 encode.
I've posted my preset elsewhere on this forum... promised to update it recently, but haven't had the time. Maybe I'll do that tonight...
Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
Has anyone ever done a comparison of a movie from the iTunes store and a DVD encode with Handbrake? I know, I know...Apple is using a good source and not a DVD. However, that movie from Apple plays everywhere. So, how does it look on a big HDTV vs a rip of a good DVD with Handbrake? (I haven't searched yet....so I'm sure I'll get flamed for this one! 
) I would really love to see some screenshots. Perhaps I need to give it a shot on my own.
I really don't want to do two encodes either. However, I know that I'm not going to want every movie available for my iPhone....so I may live with multiple entries.
Ugh....
) I would really love to see some screenshots. Perhaps I need to give it a shot on my own.I really don't want to do two encodes either. However, I know that I'm not going to want every movie available for my iPhone....so I may live with multiple entries.
Ugh....
Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
Oh, I dont know, seems to me that the "Plays Everywhere" SD itunes movies aren't all that great looking on a 60" tv either (at least their not on my 42" LCD). Since the iPods can handle loose anamorphic as well as bitrates more in the 2500 range, I would say that NightStorms new settings are as good or better than most of what you see in SD in the iTunes store.
As far as the HD rentals you can get on the atv, I would say our ATV setting is fairly comparable if you use a nice HD Program Stream as your source. As had been mentioned, if you use a dvd as your source it will not really compare but thats more due to the crappy dvd source than the HB settings and encoders.
If I take a good HD Program Stream off of my eyetv and encode it at 960 x 540 (basically what the HD movies are at on the atv) I would say that the HB output is as good if not better. Just my 02.
As far as the HD rentals you can get on the atv, I would say our ATV setting is fairly comparable if you use a nice HD Program Stream as your source. As had been mentioned, if you use a dvd as your source it will not really compare but thats more due to the crappy dvd source than the HB settings and encoders.
If I take a good HD Program Stream off of my eyetv and encode it at 960 x 540 (basically what the HD movies are at on the atv) I would say that the HB output is as good if not better. Just my 02.
Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
So, now we are back to the two encodes. I think some testing is in order. Although I don't have an aTV yet, I can get a "general" sense with FrontRow.
Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
its really quite simple actually, you encode the max for the lowest common denominator, in this case the iPods. If the iPod can play it the atv and frontrow can obviously play it. However that does not work the other way around. For instance, the current HB Built in atv preset uses bframes. iPods cannot play bframes. So you cannot use them in a "universal" setting. As I said before NightStorm has the most testing time in on a "universal" setting.
Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
I'll try and post my current preset later tonight, although I have adjusted it slightly with the introduction of VAQ in the SVN code (and the combing detection patch), so it may not be ideal for .9.2 encodes.
The reality of it is, if you want encodes that look good on both devices, you're going to have to come to the realization that the encodes are going to be big... much bigger than most people want for their 8GB iPhones (including me). With CRF (and now VAQ), and the AC3 soundtracks, I'm routinely ending up with encodes ~3GB (some smaller of course). I'm just banking on a 32GB 3G iPhone being released in the not-too-distant future, and I don't want to go through the re-encode process again (although I'm sure some new feature will change my mind
).
The reality of it is, if you want encodes that look good on both devices, you're going to have to come to the realization that the encodes are going to be big... much bigger than most people want for their 8GB iPhones (including me). With CRF (and now VAQ), and the AC3 soundtracks, I'm routinely ending up with encodes ~3GB (some smaller of course). I'm just banking on a 32GB 3G iPhone being released in the not-too-distant future, and I don't want to go through the re-encode process again (although I'm sure some new feature will change my mind
).Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
I really don't mind size. My biggest concern, as many others have stated, was iPod compatability. However, if this sacrifices quality too much, then it isn't worth it to me. I want the best picture I can get on my HDTV. If I can get iPod compatability with a minor loss, then I might accept it. Of course, I might not worry about it since most iPod compatible movies I want are kids movies....which I don't care about the quality - does that make me a bad dad? 
Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
I'm content with the quality my iPhone/AppleTV encodes, on both devices.brianlees wrote:I really don't mind size. My biggest concern, as many others have stated, was iPod compatability. However, if this sacrifices quality too much, then it isn't worth it to me. I want the best picture I can get on my HDTV. If I can get iPod compatability with a minor loss, then I might accept it. Of course, I might not worry about it since most iPod compatible movies I want are kids movies....which I don't care about the quality - does that make me a bad dad?
Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
Argh! If only I had researched/experimented more before starting ripping! I too had been using this two encode approach and I was sort of happy doing it as I read a rumour that Apple were going to add support to iTunes for better handling of multiple files for one entry, but as I have seen no more of this rumour... I'll have to start again (well prob more like doing all new encodes this way and re-do my old stuff as I need it)!nightstrm wrote:This very issue drove me crazy... I hated having 2 entries in my iTunes Library for the same movie. At first, I would still do two encodes (one for each device), and only copy the iPhone encode into my database when I wanted to sync that particular movie (using the command-key drag to not copy the file into the library directory, only create symlink).
How do other people cope with starting their DVD ripping again? I'm sure this would be my 4th/5th restart.
Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
I remember part of my reasoning... As I live in the UK, all of my DVDs are PAL and hence larger than the max height of 480, so I would have to resize (which is something I wanted to avoid). Back to plan Bcjcormack wrote:Argh! If only I had researched/experimented more before starting ripping!nightstrm wrote:This very issue drove me crazy... I hated having 2 entries in my iTunes Library for the same movie. At first, I would still do two encodes (one for each device), and only copy the iPhone encode into my database when I wanted to sync that particular movie (using the command-key drag to not copy the file into the library directory, only create symlink).
.Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
Only 4th or 5th?cjcormack wrote:Argh! If only I had researched/experimented more before starting ripping! I too had been using this two encode approach and I was sort of happy doing it as I read a rumour that Apple were going to add support to iTunes for better handling of multiple files for one entry, but as I have seen no more of this rumour... I'll have to start again (well prob more like doing all new encodes this way and re-do my old stuff as I need it)!nightstrm wrote:This very issue drove me crazy... I hated having 2 entries in my iTunes Library for the same movie. At first, I would still do two encodes (one for each device), and only copy the iPhone encode into my database when I wanted to sync that particular movie (using the command-key drag to not copy the file into the library directory, only create symlink).
How do other people cope with starting their DVD ripping again? I'm sure this would be my 4th/5th restart.
I will say I've gotten further along on the post .9.2 SVN code than I have before... just makes starting over all that much harder!
Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
I was going well until AppleTV Take 2... Rather than starting again, I've decided to keep ripping and then, when I've run out of DVDs to rip, I'll start again [repeat until HandBrake has become sentient and able to choose the perfect settings for each encode].nightstrm wrote:Only 4th or 5th?cjcormack wrote:How do other people cope with starting their DVD ripping again? I'm sure this would be my 4th/5th restart.
I will say I've gotten further along on the post .9.2 SVN code than I have before... just makes starting over all that much harder!
Sometimes I wish I'd kept the history of the different versions of my encodes - would have been interesting to see how HB has improved over the last year or so!
Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
Starting with 0.9.2 you can moving forward. the version number of handbrake is set in the itunes "Encoding Tool" metatag which is shown in iTunes Get Info.
Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
If the portable target is iPhone, you don't have to resize - it will grok up to 720x576. I presume this holds true for ATV as well.cjcormack wrote:As I live in the UK, all of my DVDs are PAL and hence larger than the max height of 480, so I would have to resize (which is something I wanted to avoid). Back to plan B
Rodney
Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
I've also taken to pasting the CLI string used for each encode in the comments tag in MetaX, so I'll always know exactly how the file was created.dynaflash wrote:Starting with 0.9.2 you can moving forward. the version number of handbrake is set in the itunes "Encoding Tool" metatag which is shown in iTunes Get Info.
Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
Ah! Useful!rhester wrote:If the portable target is iPhone, you don't have to resize - it will grok up to 720x576. I presume this holds true for ATV as well.cjcormack wrote:As I live in the UK, all of my DVDs are PAL and hence larger than the max height of 480, so I would have to resize (which is something I wanted to avoid). Back to plan B
Rodney
Just saw your other posts (I read them the other day, but obviously failed to absorb the info!). Looks like I'll do some playing with my encode settings this weekend .Yes - I spotted this in MetaX... Should be hepful. Thanksdynaflash wrote:Starting with 0.9.2 you can moving forward. the version number of handbrake is set in the itunes "Encoding Tool" metatag which is shown in iTunes Get Info.
.Useful idea.nightstrm wrote:I've also taken to pasting the CLI string used for each encode in the comments tag in MetaX, so I'll always know exactly how the file was created.
I'm not using the CLI, but I might copy the x264 Advanced Option String...Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
Geesh....I step away form the computer for a day or so and everyone has an opinion!
Anyway, I was having problems finding that post with the settings that will work on the iPhone and the aTV. Can someone help me? (I'm having a stupid day...I apologize)
Anyway, I was having problems finding that post with the settings that will work on the iPhone and the aTV. Can someone help me? (I'm having a stupid day...I apologize)
Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
I posted mine in the Best Settings thread (I think under general ?), but they are somewhat out-of-date (meaning I've since modified them). I'll post my new one as soon as I get a chance at my home iMac to grab it, although it does use some SVN (and uncommitted patches) features.brianlees wrote:Geesh....I step away form the computer for a day or so and everyone has an opinion!
Anyway, I was having problems finding that post with the settings that will work on the iPhone and the aTV. Can someone help me? (I'm having a stupid day...I apologize)
Re: iTunes, encodes for aTV and iPod - how do you organize?
If you want an iPod-conpatible encode purely for on-screen iPod viewing (not using video-out) I definitely think the way to go is doing a separate encode specifically for the iPod screen's resolution/width/height.
They are so fast in comparison to a high quality encode that you might as well, and it saves tonnes of space on the iPod. e.g. for iPod 5G set the width to 320. I only use subme=4 for these with no slow options so they encode quickly. I also slightly crop anything that it not 4:3 content to have the effect of zooming in slightly so you see much more detail. In particular 2.35:1 movies (which would normally output as 320x128 or 320x144, and be almost unwatchably small an low resultion) look massively better cropped for 320x176). This produces a far better viewing experience than even a normal 640x encode because there is no function to zoom in slightly (it's either tiny or an excessive fullscreen crop). (I also use CRF at 60% for these encodes, to maintain a constant predictable quality, which looks great on the iPod and keeps file size down, but it's not politically correct to advise CRF on iPod in the HB forums because you can theoretically run into problems.)
In terms of separating low-res and high-res movies, I find it easy: all my low res movies start with "(Movie) " before the name. This is so that all the movies group together at the start of the list on my iPod, rather than getting mixed in with documentaries, episodes of Friends, etc. If you see movies on the web starting with "(Movie) " they aren't mine, I just picked up the system from others.
They are so fast in comparison to a high quality encode that you might as well, and it saves tonnes of space on the iPod. e.g. for iPod 5G set the width to 320. I only use subme=4 for these with no slow options so they encode quickly. I also slightly crop anything that it not 4:3 content to have the effect of zooming in slightly so you see much more detail. In particular 2.35:1 movies (which would normally output as 320x128 or 320x144, and be almost unwatchably small an low resultion) look massively better cropped for 320x176). This produces a far better viewing experience than even a normal 640x encode because there is no function to zoom in slightly (it's either tiny or an excessive fullscreen crop). (I also use CRF at 60% for these encodes, to maintain a constant predictable quality, which looks great on the iPod and keeps file size down, but it's not politically correct to advise CRF on iPod in the HB forums because you can theoretically run into problems.)
In terms of separating low-res and high-res movies, I find it easy: all my low res movies start with "(Movie) " before the name. This is so that all the movies group together at the start of the list on my iPod, rather than getting mixed in with documentaries, episodes of Friends, etc. If you see movies on the web starting with "(Movie) " they aren't mine, I just picked up the system from others.